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18/08/2010 08:16"the house is run down and needs to be refurbished, lets clean the garage, that will fix the problem!"
Since the news post is now old and probably won’t be read I will ask here, what the hell are you guys doing... can someone please explain the cleaning of the forums too me? Because after spending my time writing an essay on what I think should be fixed and getting minimal discussion from admins; ndR informs us that big changes will come that will fix everything! Cleaning the forums? I honestly thought XJ had something revolutionary that would add some changes to the site/game.
Its no wonder people like me and other community members feel unheard, when legitimate suggestions are put forth but the coders and staff are too busy working on birthday notifications and other senseless features while overlooking looking at the real problems I mean cleaning the forums.... really? What a waste of time, the admins are now going to go through every thread and completely ruin the fun behind having a forum. Like I said in my essay I don’t agree with trolling and flaming but honestly I am shocked, I mean REALLY LOL?
[blockquote]I think over the years XJ has matured and grown into a professional community and no doubt in near future it'd become one of the best gaming communities all over the world. With that objective in mind, this step was clearly and without any doubt, an imminent job. My best wishes to the "clean-up" team. Just make sure not to shave off the fun element from the forums [/blockquote]
What is professional about coders implementing a IM/Friend system before creating a proper league? That is possibly the dumbest statement I have ever read, how many people have to start speaking up before the staff clue up I mean wow... XJ will NEVER be anywhere near the best gaming community if people are focusing on silly additions rather than real problems rofl..
Feel free to read my suggestions again; http://xtreme-jumps.eu/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?233853
I don't even know.. just LOL no idea.. gl I guess?
18/08/2010 11:26ye who the fuck care about the past .. this is already done in the forum . Xj won't win something from cleaning the spam past the years .. You should develope this community with more challanges like the prochallange , which was the best thing in xj I've ever saw. So think about sponsors and how to get more people playing it instead of loosing your time to clean the forums oO
yo, one of the best ideas(right after the one with the admin&user-interview) to fix all the problems lagster mentioned gj
yep lagster is right :|
18/08/2010 13:18This isn't what I was talking about lagster.
It's never been meant to be revolutionary either, m0ver is still coding what I'm talking about, but I guess it will be done during my very soon 3 weeks absence due to holidays.
18/08/2010 18:08It's still pretty ridiculous lol.
What's the point of clean up the forum?
If after some days It'll be flamed again?..
There are major priorities (You can see It where some admins do something wrong and alot of users start to complain about their decisions..For example: ban users, warning, delete user's post, etc)
I prefer satisfy the idology of some users instead of some admins...
I mean that because We are alot of people who always discuss about admins decissions in a good way for keep alive this forum.
by the way do whatever You want to, I'm losing my desire for this community
It's always the same, admins doing whatever they want to.
They don't give a fuck about what users think. (sorry for use such vocabulary)
19/08/2010 11:12Can an admin explain it too me please cause I'm still unable to understand the idea behind this decision?
[blockquote]I think over the years XJ has matured and grown into a professional community and no doubt in near future it'd become one of the best gaming communities all over the world. With that objective in mind, this step was clearly and without any doubt, an imminent job. My best wishes to the "clean-up" team. Just make sure not to shave off the fun element from the forums [/blockquote]
Wtf, I haven't seen this :D
Well confidence in what you do is never wrong but that sounded pretty funny.
Furthermore I don't get how this so called forum cleanup would put us in the right direction. I know the admins thoughts are good and they want to make this community better, however this clean up feels like the police would put their main focus on eliminate people who crosses the street while it's a red light when they have murderers and child molesters to catch.
Have you guys even seen big communitys (shooting ofc) and their forums?
My guess would be that every thread have atleast one guy trolling (mostly, its more than one guy), trying to amuse himself or others with his comment, and I'd say 50% of the topics started are double threads.
Why is that? Is it because they dont care about the forums? Or is it because their forums arent they're main focus?
Sure, if there's a ridiciously offensive comment/topic they will delete it... but some lame, no harm done comment... Who gives a fuck?
Instead you see them hosting tourneys, bringing world wide news about the game, and coverages of tournaments and brings amusing and itneresting stuff for their members.
I mean this is a gaming community, not a conference @ Microsoft with Bill Gates in charge. Just take a look at the average age of all members, and don't forget that this is the internet too, that also brings down the maturity level...
This perfect forum you're striving for can't be reached if u dont ban all of us, I'll glady bet my life on it.
...And this small changes on the webiste, feels like there a font change or something every other day. Don't waste time on this, we're fine with it. The design is fine too, just keep it original. Feels like the main focus are on the looks of the site, that I would put in the bottom of my list of things that would help the community grow/become more professional as I've said atleast 100 times now...
Have you guys swallowed the key to the door of the box you guys have put www.xtreme-jumps.eu in? Because it seems that you guys cant leave this narrow-minded thinking, font/layout/forum cleanup changes wont make this community more professional/grow.
If you dont open the door of this box and think outside of it, KZ will never be bigger than this website and its looks.
Best regards,
Zhady.
Its a mere cleaning off the dust before the "door" is opened
zhady said it all
20/08/2010 11:32I still get threatened with bans and get completely shut down even after people agree... Cheers XJ.
The forum clean up is basically what the name says. A simple forum cleanup, you guys keep thinking too deep on this situation. Were just trying to clean up the unnecessary threads and posts. It's like were trying to delete everything and warn everybody for anything. It's just a simple cleanup, that's all.
21/08/2010 13:38Your comments in my locked thread are ridiculous plague, after all of that "YoU mUsT bE fLaMiNg LAgStAh"
I was laughing at AETIUS's comments, best gaming community... NO ONE agrees with that, thus my laughter, still won't listen to me lol.. crazy.
Originally posted by LAGSTERRrRkz[a]
Your comments in my locked thread are ridiculous plague, after all of that "YoU mUsT bE fLaMiNg LAgStAh"
I was laughing at AETIUS's comments, best gaming community... NO ONE agrees with that, thus my laughter, still won't listen to me lol.. crazy.
[blockquote]But now, clean up the fucking act. Stop acting immature and shouting at people (this is not pointing a single person out). Nothing is gonna get done when people just continue to insult each other. Maybe your not trying to insult anybody lagster, but by the way you keep saying things, it's hard to say that your not trying to insult people. I don't care if people curse to get their point across. But there is a line that you can cross, and you're right on the edge.[/blockquote]
I didn't point that comment directly at you. But i had to close it for a specific reason. You can't just "LOL" because someone disagrees with you or whatever you "LOL" about, and how are my comments "ridiculous" it's pointing out facts. I closed it because you started to not take it seriously. If you didn't read what i said, i said i loved the thread, but soon as you started getting offended, i closed it. There's no sense in letting a thread go on like that, when you know it's just gonna get worse.
Food for thought : (for LAgStAh ofc)
Unlike you, I don't beg or curse everyone to give into my views. Unlike you, I always respect others opinion. Unlike you, I don't abuse anyone just cuz they have a different viewpoint. Unlike you, I know how to be decent and how to be well-mannered. And above all, unlike you, I dont pretend to care for the community by pointing out others mistakes (I try to work them out in order to lessen their load )...
Since you have already had a pretty good laugh, I hope you are calm wnough to think now :)
21/08/2010 14:43give into my views? read the responses from non-admins, cheers mate.
Very bad thread title lagster, you know that and you should rename it. Also wrong section.
I am personally completely against all this cleanup. It makes no sense, the past is the past, everything the forum cleanup admins will cause is a lose of our forumculture. Sometimes I love reading in old threads to remember the old days, but when these old threads are now cleaned of spam, you blunder the past. This is dangerous and makes no sense at all. To quote a very old forum member, also from a very old topic: "hahahahahahahaha otcheto ftw, always entertaining... what would xj be without ppl like you? probably boring and filled with nerds who think its cool to hate ljing."
This post, for example, might be considered as spam and therefore deleted, even though it contains good content. I fear that you destroy what is left from the old days and I am really really against it.
Its no wonder people like me and other community members feel unheard, when legitimate suggestions are put forth but the coders and staff are too busy working on birthday notifications and other senseless features while overlooking looking at the real problems
Stop generalizations.
What a waste of time, the admins are now going to go through every thread and completely ruin the fun behind having a forum.
I agree and fear the same.
best gaming communities all over the world
Obviously a dream that can not become true.
Have you guys even seen big communitys (shooting ofc) and their forums?
I pointed that out some time ago and I have said it many times... The problem is not our rules, or the warning system or whatever. It is just normal that a gaming community is not a place where flights of fancy are exchanged.
beg or curse everyone to give into my views
That's not true.
21/08/2010 16:26(edited 22/08/2010 06:03)Originally posted by pLaguEツThe forum clean up is basically what the name says. A simple forum cleanup, you guys keep thinking too deep on this situation. Were just trying to clean up the unnecessary threads and posts. It's like were trying to delete everything and warn everybody for anything. It's just a simple cleanup, that's all.
Yes, exactly. It's not like we're trying to kill the freedom of expression or hunt down every troll or spammer; we're just removing obvious spam and double posts (and stuff alike) for the sake of a better forum quality, alongside a few other changes that are about to come (once m0ver finished coding them).
zhady: Very wise words, you can be sure that I know such sites and I know about the gaming community and the, at least verbal, poor standard in it. However, you got to admit that the amount of spam posts and rules violation are disproportionately high on XJ, especially since the other communities are having even more members (and less "idiots").
Also this was - and still is - one of the major problems that is scaring off possible sponsors. I've heard this quite a few times... "It’s pointless to support your community, you have a lot of young and immature members, they do NOT have the money (lot of them are even using non-steam because they can't or don't want to spend 5€ for a legal copy of counter-strike) nor the age to legally buy our products".
That is why we HAVE to do something against it, for the sake of the whole community.
Furthermore, since missing sponsors was one of the points I saw in some complaints against our management, let's go a bit deeper into that topic:
Possible sponsors didn't like our global website statistics, too. We got about 10k unique visits every day now, which is pretty amazing, but most of our user base is visiting the website from eastern countries. I'm not trying to disrespect these countries, we're happy about every user no matter where you're from, but apparently some companies think that these countries don't have enough monetary funds or "potential" to buy their products either. There's nothing we can do about it other than keep trying to find new partners that are more "open minded"... but if YOU want to help us in this struggle, there is one thing you guys can do though... support our current sponsors and click the banners (instead of complaining about them).
Having said that, I can and have to admit (obviously you were aiming for that statement lagster) that XJ is not "professional" yet.
And having said that, you should know how a community like this works.
Admins are recruited (or join) on a voluntarily base; they give as much of their free time as they are willing to give. Sure, the management is trying to pursue a global agenda, but we've made the experience (not only one time) that if you're telling people to do stuff they don't want to do, they mostly end up leaving the staff again very soon and leave their projects behind unfinished or inactive; which is not good for the site nor for the community as well. That's why we're usually letting guys run projects they WANT to do.
About the complaints regarding our coder/the chat features:
It's pretty much the same, m0ver is working on a unpaid base, he joined the XJ staff as a coder because he wanted to help the community but, of course, he had personal motives (such as getting better in coding, learning new things and getting practical experience whilst working on a "living" site) as well. He tries to code scripts that are needed for the other admins (just like the hard/extreme league, or the upcoming scripts for the forum/site to improve the forum quality) but besides that he works on stuff he's learning momentarily and/or stuff he thinks that might do well on the site, like the mentioned chat system.
About the requested league/ladder system, I agree, it would be amazing for the development of KZ, but it's off the limits for m0ver (he doesn't have enough time for such a project, nor is it a one-man project anyway at all) and probably the hardest thing to achieve coding-wise. It's not like nobody tried, as far as I know there were 3 attempts (one even had already bought its own domain and servers) to make it come true, but none of them succeeded.
You should know yourself how hard it is to make big projects come true with little or no help at all. It's not like your tournament was doomed by our staff, you could have run it on your own and we would have still helped with news posts and PR. You can't say we're not supporting KZ tourneys that are being held on other sites; we DO... just like the fragfighters one, which you commented with "fuck you all" by the way. Very grown up...
Anyway, back to topic.
Sure, the league/ladder is on our TODO list, but it is not possible to take care of it right now. In the end we probably have to employ some professional coders to take care of it, which is not possible in the moment because the monetary reserves we had were used for the new design, which is about to come (even hard enough to find a proper guy to install this btw, as it is WAY more complex than the current one and we saw 3-4 guys try and stop this as well :/). With the new design the site will look a lot more professional, has a lot more space for sponsors/ads to place their content and hopefully attract more sponsors. Also I have a lot of letters prepared for some of companies that are sponsoring e-sports related sites or clans, but I'm not going to submit them under the old and rather ugly design (compared to the new one), when a new and kickass design just waits to be released (we used ALL of the old donations + quite a big sum from my own bank account to buy the new design).
Talking about the money... please remember... our management PAYS from our own money (and time, of course) every month to keep the site alive, it's not like we're making any money out of this.
I hope this rough review helps to calm down your quite negative view on our staff/management lagster, because the way you're posting your (partly valid, can't deny that) suggestions/complaints makes it very hard for us (at least for me) to believe you're having positive intentions.
Sure, I believe you want the community to be a better place to be, but your text is giving the impression that you would rather see this happen with something like a revolution taking place instead of constant and little improvement based on suggestions (because you doubt the current staff is competent enough to handle this community?). Am I, at least partly, right with my suspicion?
So what's the conclusion?
I hope you guys can see that we are indeed trying to make the best out of what we've got, which is in some cases... not as much as you might think.
"It’s pointless to support your community, you have a lot of young and immature members, they do NOT have the money (lot of them are even using non-steam because they can't or don't want to spend 5€ for a legal copy of counter-strike) nor the age to legally buy our products".
If this is was the sponsors say, what can we do about i? What you try now is to make very hard and straight rules, so immature forum posts and members get their punishment and with that cleanup the forum might look more mature in the end. So you want to fake the average attitude of our members and thereby the age of our members? (The sponsors concluded from the behaviour of the members to their age, you want to change the behaviour to fake the age?)
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