About the KZMod 2.0 first release

lol some ideas here like getting 280 pre after a 300+ 1 frame bhop would rape the game, everyone would do 240-245 bhops everywhere but sure go ahead

Originally posted by ShoCk

Here is a task for you to solve:

LEWLY has 100 wrs.
Cobrex (insert any other name) has 0 wrs.
Both have identical conditions, same time put, same devices.
Question: Why does LEWLY have more wrs?

Come for the answer when you die to know.

To start, let me clarify that none of KZMod's game design decisions have been made because of cheaters. This change as made to try and improve the bhop experience of 1.6 players, and wasn't made to attract a larger playerbase either.

I can understand why some people might be fearing this has ruined the skill requirements of bhop, but in my opinion all this has done has just made already established bhop techniques reliable. Everyone I've watched test this still does the same technique as before, the difference is they don't stop unless they miss the scroll or mess up the strafes, which I feel is just more fun than trying to time your bhop to the perfect frame, which is inherently unreliable.

The only change that has been made is instead of having to jump perfectly on the frame, you can jump within 1 millisecond of when you hit the ground. The speed cap and jump height reduction are all still there. If you miss the 1 ms window, you lose your speed like normal. The only people who are flying through maps with this change are those who were already highly skilled and could do it most of the time anyway.

When making design decisions, I've always felt the best feature is the one that is the most versatile, but also the most reliable. It's always much more fun to try and improve with something when you know that doing an action will have the expected effect. Like it or not, there are quite a few people who just didn't like bhop simply because it was possible that they could miss their bhop due to some framerate hitch or other problem, which then makes you feel cheated by the game, or feel unlucky, and so on. There is still plenty scope to be frustrated here. You could miss your bhop, screw up a strafe, but at least you won't feel the game cheated you when you felt your technique was flawless.

This change isn't autobhop because if you scroll at the wrong time you will still lose your speed. Ultimately the effect and reception of this is down to everyone else, not me, all I ask is that you see the potential benefits in having a more reliable and fun gameplay experience and how pros can use that reliablity to attempt better strafing and other things. I will also point out that making non-axn bhop easier to learn for new players is not a bad thing - if this change did make bhop easier, than maps can become harder to compensate, instead of bhop mode AA 50 bhop being the only bhop new players can feel they accomplished something in. This change was made for the benefit of existing bhoppers though, not new players.

wow you can parent entities together? does that mean you can build an elevator where the doors actually move along with the elevator? for example when you tell the elevator go one floor up the doors will go up too?

[blockquote]You can't love art as much as coding (for example) .[/blockquote]

Coding IS an art.

Raptor can you tell me how this wallbug sc on shrubhop is possible?:D https://www.dropbox.com/s/oh7p82uyo3etz1m/0demo.rar?dl=0

Originally posted by ShoCk

Originally posted by Cobrex

This is what kzmod fixes. I play 1.6 since early 2009 ... don't you think normally there should be a demo of mine on the record list until now?

No, I don't take such things for granted. Although, sometimes I really do fail at understanding how someone who's playing a game regularly for years can't do things.

Here is a task for you to solve:

LEWLY has 100 wrs.
Cobrex (insert any other name) has 0 wrs.
Both have identical conditions, same time put, same devices.
Question: Why does LEWLY have more wrs?

Come for the answer when you die to know.

Originally posted by Mathzz

If it wasn't broken, why are so worried about this change? Nothing changed for you right? Or do you KNOW that there's something broken and you don't want it fixed?

Of course I'm still dealing with difficulties, but that makes the process even more enjoyable. These difficulties eliminate talents out of the mass, that's what makes it for a good game. With this change applied, there will be no longer feel of accomplishment and that's about it.

Originally posted by sooshka

false comparison, implementing autoaim would remove skill. We didn't remove any skill, we removed randomness, if anything, it takes MORE skill now. There's far more to kz than timing the bhop (and yes timing the bhop is STILL there). Sure maybe all times will get better, but the concept will remain the same. Think of it as a slight gameplay change. There will still be one record holder and recording will still take a lot of time and skill, JUST WITHOUT the randomness.

True, you ease just one of the few aspects of the game while for good perfomance you need to control others. It's the same in cs:go that you referred to as a false example, you've got auto aim but there are still other things to master such as recoil control, positioning, movement in general, tactic etc. In kz besides bhop there are strafes and understanding of physics. Not a false comparison at all.

Mathzz outlined the purposes quite well, but then again, achieving a goal at any cost, for this case sacrifying gameplay for widening the audience. While every part of me wants the game to thrive, I'm just not sure if that's a good solution. I didn't really give kzmod a try after that change has been applied, only got fancy, but even if it stays there permanently I imagine myself still playing it since like you said, nothing in my own gameplay should change at all, except for what I pointed out. Still have to give it a try.

Originally posted by sooshka

no man, it looks like we're not on the same page and are talking about different kinds of randomness. Let me give you an example in terms of surfing. Let's say there's a surf map called surf_bob and if you went down the first section at an angle of 45 degrees you would ALWAYS get 1000 speed (which is like it is right now in kzmod). Now let's introduce the nasty randomness which I'm talking about and the following would happen: Player does the first section at 45 degrees and the game is like, hmm i'm just gonna give him 500 speed this time for no reason at all even though he deserved 1000. Player does the first section at 45 degrees again and the game is like, hmmm, gonna give him 700 this time. Player does it for the third time, and the game is like okay okay, i'll give him 1000 speed as it should be this time.

I mean wtf???? Why are you arguing in favor of such a gameplay that would make people's IQ drop as they played it?

Originally posted by sooshka

You mentioned something like it wouldn't feel as an accomplishment anymore. Hahaha, couldn't disagree more. My mto_bhops demo that's still lingering around on cosy afaik, that playing experience was absolute trash and I didn't feel like I accomplished anything. It felt like it was a stupid lucky run which wasn't different from any of my other runs where I scrolled in the same manner but for some stupid reason, this time I didn't slow down. Shaktiblock? same story, absolute garbage that experience was. Made me want to quit the game. I would've rather not gotten a wr and have an enjoyable run as opposed to getting a random wr.

Originally posted by ShoCk

So..

you don't feel accomplished beating a wr
your playing experience is absolute trash

why even playing if not for self-accomplishment neither for joy?

sooshka <3

And do you feel self-accomplishment from your remembering skills?