Delicate matters.

Things happens fast on this jumping community, KZmaps and Xtreme-Jumps suddenly splitted. Now we have 2 different communities - With XJ as the biggest, it's enorm. Pro's joins the battle in the top5 competetion, and they stay there for 6 months and then quits.

Now we have a Worldcup going, a nation cup. It could become much more serious though. But where are the sponsors, never see any sponsors, even though this community has 34423 users at the moment - We could get a lot of sponsors, could be cool to see players named steelpad or razor at the end of their nicks. But then we need to turn to more than DreamHack, we need to get KZ into tournaments on a regular basis.

KZmod soon out, it should be very good, really hope that. Will that takeover CS 1.6 KZ jumping? Who knows.

And one of the big questions that has occupied my mind lately, will the future be able to beat the records we have now? They are really becomming good, and the modelmovement are close to perfect - Will the jumpers in the future be much better than now? I doubt it, even though we lately have been seing a superboost in the KZ skill overall, with kimo and target launching a extremely superb fast Bhop and lowmicro skill, which made them able to beat courages many records. ndR, Z0ck3rOO7 and zhady are a product of that style. With those things mixed you can suddely reach very low times on easy maps, so will the scene even pull newcomers in the future I wonder, it would seem impossible to beat records for a newcomer I believe.

What are your opinion?

Will the scene evolve? Will it grow?

I don't think that the players will be much better then now. But the demo times now can be beaten. You can always bhop a little more that the guy who made the demo.

The longjumprecord will be beaten but I think it will just be 1 - 2 units. Tjubby did few days ago 253, 253 and 255 with count technique. But I don't see how count technique should help him jump longer in longjumps so my oppinion is that his demo should be accepted as new world record. It is not like he is losing edgefriction with this tech..

If his demo will not be accepted then we know that it is possible to get 255.

hmm more maps in kz is same as more teams in 1.6 if more and more good mappers will do kz maps it will made this scene grow..

mhh who knows if 260 will be beaten.. 2-3 years a go when someone did 245 people was:
"250 it's the maxium you can jump" and if someone would had said "someone will do 254 units" people would had tought he is a joker.. so who knows who knows.. and there is a lot maps where you can do better time.. you just need to do everything perfect wich is kind a crazy but still possible

biggest part where kz-scene could grow imo is a cup/lan because its ONLY 5mins and one drop can mean lost to you.. so you need to practise many days 1 map so you can do nice run in 5mins
if you look some good records. how much time those jumpers has spent to do those records? i think A LOT and they could try as many times as they want.. but in cup/lan match you got that 5mins and that it imo good cupjumper is better that good wr maker because you need much more skill to do perfect run w/o mistakes.

so what i am tryin to say is that this scene should go more and more to cup / lan events neither than wr-recording. i compaire it to 1.6. pro-teams practise like hell and play pracc wars.. those doesnt mean anything if your tactics is fucked up in cpl or same kind of tournament.

and what i mean by cup is like 32 or 64 players cups wich can be
three days long where the winner continues and loser drops not some 8player 30min cup
[ Edited Wed Mar 14 2007, 12:51PM ]

Well, to expand greatly on my previous post, I don't believe kz has a lot left to offer to people by means of a nice game to play in your free time. The game has turned into a geeks-only bug-finding stupid-technique using machine that will put many newcomers off the game altogether.

Why?

Firstly, this new Countjump is bullshit imo (no flames plzpzlpzlpzlpzl). It's like saying to a newcomer who wants to longjump "ok, first of all learn how to multistrafe using a few strafes to begin with, then try to incorporate a prestrafe into it. Learnt that? Good. Now discard most of that knowledge and use this new technique that is possibly out of your league and may take you months to master." I don't think most people want to do that (only tjubby is atm). It's also annoying for pros who have spent months upon months mastering the lj technique and don't want to learn the Count technique, and all their hard work could just be easily owned by an 'easy' technique (for other pros) to master.

Secondly, the ultimate geekers zhady, ndR, Z0ck3rOO7 etc are pushing the boundaries of records to the point of unbeatableness (inventingwords|ftw). Most records these days require hours of patience and involve you having to jump as fast as possible with as many bhops, tricks and scs as possible just to beat a rec by a few secs. I've seen quite a few people get their first rec here, only to be beaten the next day by a pro. I don't see these people make more recs. Demotivation? The fact that you can make a rec then get it beaten by 20 odd secs by a geeky record holder isn't nice on newcomers who want to have their moment of glory (nothing against the geeks of course -_-)

Most of the new maps released are boring/feel the same as every other map before it. Repeated material is boring most of the pros I know and some of them have quit kz due to this boredom. Maps are too hard these days for newcomers too.

I reckon kzmod COULD have a positive effect on the 1.6 scene, but also a negative effect. Some of the pro jumpers and others could move over to kzmod and some could stay. Pros moving to kzmod would open up more possibilities here for newcomers to the scene who can beat recs with some reassurance that they won't instantly get pwned back. But if too many people leave the scene it could wreck it.

Dunno what else to say really, except that there are/will be too many maps in future and this sucks too. Some maps should be taken off the kz_ tag imo, and WAY TOO MANY PEOPLE are settling for the basic custom seen-it-all-before 2 minute long bhop map. Use your imagination people...

Well, that's just what I think. From my point of view, kz has actually got worse from the time I joined. It was so much more fun 9 months ago.

I never said kz wasn't for fun. Doing recs is like the ultimate goal for people who want to take kz that far. People can still have fun while recording. I never said that everyone wants recs, and I'm sure 99% of people have fun while playing kz, otherwise they wouldn't be playing it, right?

Agree with Boolish.. nice words..

I hope new division will be.

Seems like I hitted the softspot ;)

All i have to say is that "demotivation" is the best pun i've heard this week (intended or unintended).
I also agree with BooLiSH.

i write couple sentences what think is fucked up in kz-scene and what should be improvement to this scene.

first of all.. i dont think kreedz made his maps so that people could do two edges, three jumpbugs and five cuntjumps to rape his maps best they can..
when i started kz (about 3years ago) people was just jumping in puplic server for fun and to find new things and to jump longer and longer.. it wasent important if you made mistakes.. you just continued without watching time.. nowdays i see too many newcomers doing map like eztemple into temple and then they do 1 mistake and after it they write /start. i just dont get it.. (im not good to say because i use /start too often too).
and if you go to wr's.. in normal cs every year is new champion (or maybe same team wins two years a row) but it got change every year.. but in kz if some chinese geek with 5inch goggles does i.e eaglecliff in 1.30 will it been beaten ever? i doubt that

and to the improvements.
x-j map-admins should not accept maps w/o healt-button so that people cant rape those maps (if you want to make map like gigablock, block those edgesc's with invisible wall)
i.e gigablock with edge or jumpbug and to maps wich are allready under kz_ tag or custom tag there should be i.e kz_ep_gigablock_b01[+edge/jumpbug] and kz_ep_gigablock_b01[-edge/jumpbug] because i dont see anything nice if someone pwns map fast with edge or jumpbug.. i.e i rather watch HoHo^ doing gigablock in 6.xx or 7.xx rather than now when he has finished it in 3.xx with edge.

also something new to cups.. bigger more competitors,
tournaments etc. because i see cup/tournament as a nowday in kz, not wr's..

in every tournament is a new winner or if someone can win two tournaments imo he is alot more skilled than guy with 20wr's and also newcomers got better change to show their skill in earlier stages..
like how much would take time to a guy who starts kz today to make his first wr or an another guy who starts kz today and take parts in tournaments to him win or place in top 5 or something like that in a tournament. imo a guy who becomes good in tournaments has a better change to get know rather than a guy who hasent made any wr's
and..
whats the biggest thing.. kz meant to be played together.. not alone (like a wr geekers in their host servers) but thats only my opinion..

sorry from typos or if i have miss-spelled something. english isn't my mothertongue
:)

Simply: KZ and XJ are not 'noob' friendly, in my opinion. Back in the good days, we had WRs and we had people submitting them, but there was no mad competition. We had our pros (suPa, helferlein etc), but they just submitted whenever and had a laugh whilst doing it.

There is not enough range in map difficulties anymore. As the community has progressed, everyone has become better jumpers, but the beginners haven't. The maps, WRs and everything else - including the attitude of the community - have moved on from the beginner days in a bad way. It needs to change if we want kz to survive.

Public servers were amazing to play on. Everyone seemed to have a great time, everyone jumped for fun fun fun and indeed, there were very few 'retry' in console due to a fall (but let's face it, climbing can be annoying!).

LJs? Most boring thing I've ever seen. If they're good for the community, they're good for the community though - or are they?

I'm pretty certain we had a no-wallbug, no-sc policy on the WRs back in the day too - that might've changed after I left though.

The future of kz

Where does it lie? I don't think it lies in KZMod - I don't think enough people will want to play it, it's not quite CS 1.6, it's a bit too different for a lot of us.

The way forward for 1.6 KZ is indeed cups, tournaments and just general fun that everyone can play in, be involved with the best players and have a shot at winning (and when they don't, at least getting the chance to fight it out with the best).

There are a couple of things going on at kzmaps to happen soon, and that should help things along a bit, but we need more and we need them to be around all the time. We can't have a kz world cup then absolute dead silence for a couple of months - there is no fun in that whatsoever. I'd fire in a couple of suggestions, but at the moment, I'll keep shush - what do you guys think?